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Post by alphaz on Jul 17, 2019 5:54:56 GMT 10
I am using 3DS MAX and I keep trying to make a version of Claire's classic tank top outfit without the spats, shoulder holster, ammo mags, fanny pack, shoulder knife or radio. I am able to export it perfectly EXCEPT for model is suddenly covered in bad normals or something. It looks like this from afar: But when you zoom in on her skin (especially neck seam and the knees), or on most of her clothes, you see these kind of glitches: Like why is that black dot materializing on her left leg in that export (w/o the radio)? What's with her knees and huge visible body seams in all exports? There are also weird patterns that look like bad normals on her shorts and tank top, and a big black spot on the back of her tank top. I already applied the "Edit Normals" modifier to average the normals on her arms and legs, since I had to change the geometry of the arms+legs submesh to remove the spats, but it doesn't seem to be doing anything. Every other bit of clothing except the belt is unchanged from the original model and I shouldn't need to mess with the normals or UVs for them. I am using my 5 cloned copies of the arms+legs submesh (one for each LODGroup, and imported from Noesis FBX then skin wrapped properly) and exporting them with the many submeshes I wanted to keep from the original imported model to get this result, using my modded submeshes in place of the default arms+legs submesh. I kept trying to get rid of these glitches and they never would go away, so finally I tried just importing the official Classic Tank Top mesh and just immediately exporting it again without changing anything at all (this has worked perfectly for me before with all modded models I've tried it on) just to see what'd happen, and THE SAME normal map / UV errors happened somehow. Actually they looked worse; she looks like she has a cigarette burn on her back: It should look exactly the same as the standard classic tank top outfit, because I changed absolutely nothing. Maybe the cigarette-burn UV error on her back didn't occur on the modded arms+legs submesh I made before because I was able to average normals for it? But even still, that one looked like it had bad normals anyway, like in the second pic I posted. Why is this happening, and how can I fix it? EDIT: I re-imported the unchanged exported mesh I'd made of the original costume (that had the inexplicable errors on it) and looked at the UV maps and they seemed absolutely fine. So I guess it is not UV errors? Those black dots look like UV errors I've seen before, like where one vertex is misplaced and it creates a pentagon shaped hole. EDIT 2: It appears to have something to do with the costume slot for the Classic Tank Top outfit, as I combined everything that fit on one UV map file into one model / submesh and exported it to the Elza Walker slot - skin-wrapping it to a mod outfit - and there are no glitches on that version. But I still want to use it on its actual slot because that's where it goes (and it allows for a working holster and grenade-launcher strap)
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Posts: 366
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Post by mangakagirl on Jul 21, 2019 7:37:31 GMT 10
script doesnt import original normals. so you need to average them before export
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Post by alphaz on Jul 25, 2019 11:08:36 GMT 10
script doesnt import original normals. so you need to average them before export Sometimes I don't average them when exporting untouched submeshes that I'd just imported and I do not have any issues with the normals in-game. But other times (like now) I do have issues and I can't figure out what's causing them, so now I do usually average them all anyway and then say "make unique", just in case. It still doesn't seem to be helping though, and I look at other people's mods for Claire's Classic outfits (like the Darkside Chronicles mod) and they have the same weird visible seams and things like glitches on her knees. I tried inverting the G channel of my normal maps and that fixed some minor issues I was having with the version I made for the Elza Walker slot, but not for the original version I made for the Claire Classic Tank Top slot. Right now though I am kind of frustrated over Katherine Warren's head. I am trying to export her head with the neck shrunk down so it won't clip through the body-necks for Claire's many modded bodies, and every time I do it the eyes get all messed up like this: Like with the Classic Tank Top, I can import the Katherine head model and immediately export it (with or without averaging normals) and it will export with glitches when I use it in the game. I downloaded a couple of face mods for Katherine and I noticed that one of them had this same issue with their eyes too ("Beauty Katherine" from Nexus) and the other did not ("Katherine single ponytail replaces Claire Noir Ver1.5" by Snipz/Evilord). Averaging normals seems to make no difference. I re-imported my model I just made with the messed up eyes and looked at the UVs and saw this: Those green lines inside the eye were not there before, and when I move some of the vertexes they are connected to, I see duplicate vertexes are behind them. It is not like this with the original imported model, and this does not happen when I export any other character's eyes. What gives? Is this a glitch in Maliwei's script that has since been corrected? I exported the eyes as FBX into Noesis FBX and re-imported them fresh /cleared, and nothing changed. I even tried moving + resizing Claire's eyes, putting them in Katherine's head and exporting them like they were Katherine's, and the same exact glitch happened inside Claire's eyes. Someone help
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Posts: 366
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Post by mangakagirl on Jul 25, 2019 11:46:44 GMT 10
script doesnt import original normals. so you need to average them before export Sometimes I don't average them when exporting untouched submeshes that I'd just imported and I do not have any issues with the normals in-game. But other times (like now) I do have issues and I can't figure out what's causing them, so now I do usually average them all anyway and then say "make unique", just in case. It still doesn't seem to be helping though, and I look at other people's mods for Claire's Classic outfits (like the Darkside Chronicles mod) and they have the same weird visible seams and things like glitches on her knees. I tried inverting the G channel of my normal maps and that fixed some minor issues I was having with the version I made for the Elza Walker slot, but not for the original version I made for the Claire Classic Tank Top slot. Right now though I am kind of frustrated over Katherine Warren's head. I am trying to export her head with the neck shrunk down so it won't clip through the body-necks for Claire's many modded bodies, and every time I do it the eyes get all messed up like this: Like with the Classic Tank Top, I can import the Katherine head model and immediately export it (with or without averaging normals) and it will export with glitches when I use it in the game. I downloaded a couple of face mods for Katherine and I noticed that one of them had this same issue with their eyes too ("Beauty Katherine" from Nexus) and the other did not ("Katherine single ponytail replaces Claire Noir Ver1.5" by Snipz/Evilord). Averaging normals seems to make no difference. I re-imported my model I just made with the messed up eyes and looked at the UVs and saw this: Those green lines inside the eye were not there before, and when I move some of the vertexes they are connected to, I see duplicate vertexes are behind them. It is not like this with the original imported model, and this does not happen when I export any other character's eyes. What gives? Is this a glitch in Maliwei's script that has since been corrected? I exported the eyes as FBX into Noesis FBX and re-imported them fresh /cleared, and nothing changed. I even tried moving + resizing Claire's eyes, putting them in Katherine's head and exporting them like they were Katherine's, and the same exact glitch happened inside Claire's eyes. Someone help come to remodding discord or mine. i cant write here much its hard to help
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Post by alphaz on Jul 26, 2019 10:52:42 GMT 10
Thanks, I fixed the Katherine eyes issue by attaching her eyeballs to her face submesh and just exporting the model without the eyes submesh at all. There is just something wrong with that eyes submesh in the default model. I thought merging her eyes with her face might make her unable to turn her eyes, but they still can look around like normal.
My problem with the Claire classic tank top outfit still remains
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Post by alphaz on Oct 10, 2019 10:19:26 GMT 10
Bumping because this is an extremely pervasive problem that I have seen on literally every modded model that uses more than one submesh! Seriously, take *any* modded model for this game and look closely at the clothes or bag, holster, belt - whatever that is not a part of the model's LODGroup_1_MainMesh_1_Submesh_1. You will see strange cracks and fissures that break up the textures unnaturally and mess up the smoothness and natural look of the lighting reflecting off the mesh. The lighting on many parts of the model completely changes from how it should be. Only Submesh_1 is immune to this problem, for whatever reason. Why does this happen? Is it just a problem with Maliwei's script? Why does submesh 1 work fine but none of the others ever do? Even the highest quality paid mods by Arison_C have this problem if you look closely enough, and he has a mastery of hex editing this game that I've not seen in anyone else (I don't get how he understands mastermaterial files at all). Am I seriously the first person to talk about this, or has there been some discussion about it elsewhere? Look here, I made a couple animated GIFs to compare the original Classic Tank Top mesh file from Capcom's game files with the same mesh file that's been imported to and exported back over itself from 3DS MAX. Absolutely nothing was changed about the version that went through MAX besides adding an Edit Normals modifier (which is necessary because the script does not preserve the original normals). You can see above that the shape of her arm even changes to be kinda lumpy on the version that went through the script, and the lighting on her belt changes completely. The Classic Tank Top outfit is a bit different in that it doesn't have a LODGroup_1_MainMesh_1_Submesh_1 for her skin or for anything; the first mesh in its list is Submesh_2, and that is her necklace chain. Its version of Submesh_1 is part of MainMesh_5, and it's her pistol in its holster. I also imported the created mesh with the errors back into MAX again to inspect for anything different, and found that everything (including both UV channels) was exactly the same as the official imported mesh that I'd exported to create it. EDIT: I managed to make her skin and knees look perfect by renaming her skin's submesh from submesh_8 to submesh_2 (the chain, which I then omitted), and then by inverting the green channel on the classic tanktop's normal map file. All the other submeshes were still messed up though. It seems that only the first submesh that the script processes is able to be free of these errors, whether it's named 1 or 2 or if its a chain or a body, it doesn't matter - it just must be first.
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Post by alphaz on Oct 16, 2019 2:17:01 GMT 10
So yeah there is one submesh on the classic tank top pl1003 model that is immune to all these glitches - the one for the necklace chain (first in the list in MAX's schematic view). So I moved the skin parts over and edited the pl1003.MDF2 file to give the necklace chain's submesh its own wetmask and its own skin-detail normal map, and now the skin looks perfect. The glitches are only on the clothes. Also I copied over the hex header from a version of my same modded mesh that I exported with Shigu's new 0.5b script (that has the "spotty normals" fix) and it seemed to fix a lot of the normals glitches without messing up the rigging. All original wetmasks and detail maps are intact for the clothes You can still see glitches like in the line on her shorts, on the bottom of her shirt, and on the tongues of her boots, but they are not as bad as they were. I do hope we can get rid of this problem completely in the future, like we did with the uroboros glitch for faces now. It makes a lot of modders use only the one submesh that is error-free, but doing that prevents them from using different detail maps for different submeshes, and detail maps can make your models look like they have like 8k resolution normal maps up-close
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Post by alphaz on Feb 3, 2020 17:54:44 GMT 10
I have discovered that you can change a float value called "SSS_ProfileNumber" for a submesh-material in the MDF file of your model and it will get rid of a significant amount of the spotty normals on that submesh. Change it to 4, 5 or 6 from the default value '7'. Now I did this with the 010 Editor MDF template by Che, but you can do this a bit more blindly just using HxD and searching for Hex Bytes, finding all instances of " 00 00 80 3F 00 00 80 3F 00 00 00 00 00 00 E0 40". Most importantly, you are looking for " 00 00 E0 40", which means 7. Change that part to " 00 00 A0 40" to switch the SSS_ProfileNumber of a material to 5. You will have to do this for every material / submesh that has the value.
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